Unfortunately, folks don't come into this world with a knowledge of what God says in His Word; nor do they have the wisdom to rightly divide the word of truth. In America we have the freedom to choose; and along with this freedom to choose comes the freedom to believe whatever you want. While God wants us to make the right decision, His will is never forced upon us. His plan for us, however, is not very difficult; at least not more difficult than we make it. While the road might be narrow, millions have made it. Perhaps we can too if we follow the right path.
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| Choosing the right path is not as difficult as we were led to believe |
You can recognize the bad path because it is traveled by bad people. They know they are bad and they don't try to hide it. Unfortunately our nature wants us to take this path and be around the others who choose this path. Our flesh loves this path because it is full of things that are bad for us and that take us in a different direction than God wants us to go. The Map we were given warns us not to go down this path and if we choose this path it's not by accident, nor is it by ignorance. We know we are wrong if we choose to do the things that 'everyone else' is doing. The people that walk in this direction ignore love and desire only to fulfill their own lusts and desires. As bad as this may sound, there is more hope for the people on this path than there is for people on the religious path. The difference is that the people that have chosen the bad path are the ones that God usually ends up saving, while the people on the religious path don't acknowledge that they need to be saved.
The religious make up a large percentage of the population of America. The people that travel down this path have chosen to have the best of both worlds. They expend a great deal of energy trying to convince others that they are on the good path but their footsteps are not following the map to heaven. They present a standard that is impossible to live by, and they expect others to conform to, while their own actions are hidden in the darkness that surrounds their hearts. In many ways they are worse than those who are on the dark path because they fight against the good and try to tear them down while their own desires are to profit from them. The religious are made up of a mixture of good and bad. The religious also fall into the ugly category because what they do to people is ugly and they do things that are so wrong that even the bad people cringe at the thought of their deeds. When you get involved with a religious group that was set up by a con artist, you find yourself among the worst of the worst. These types of people are usually sexually perverted and they make money off of your suffering. The only way to escape a group like this is to read your bible and compare it closely to the lives of your leaders.
We have determined that the ntcc is religious and the only good that exists within the organization are the people who are not willfully deceiving others but are lost and not using their map to navigate their way out. They have good intentions and they may know that things are not right but they allow others to influence their thinking to the point where not even God can get their attention. The ntcc preaches good, but lives bad and covers it all up with ugly religion. The ntcc specializes in placing a calling on your life that exists only for their own greedy and selfish benefit. People feel like they have to belong to a religion or a church because of Hebrews 10:25. The ntcc uses that scripture to convince people to attend 5 or more church services per week, but even with that busy schedule the leaders of the ntcc have found time to visit whorehouses on your dime, molest young girls while their equally religious parents turn a blind eye or even make the arrangements themselves and build a real estate empire bought and payed for by your tithe dollars. If they can convince you to pay tithe contrary to the New Testament, what else can they get you to do. You are lost inside an organization. They have deceived you and used you for their own gain.
I was not exempt from the blindness and the religious nightmare that so many have awoken from. When it happened to me and I was so messed up when I got out, I chose to travel the bad path. I didn't want anything to do with good anymore because I didn't really know what good was. I thought good was paying your tithe and going to church and attending conferences. It's easy to get lost inside a cult. The leadership kept everything hidden from me. Al Gore had just invented the internet and at that time Factnet and the blogs didn't exist, but even if they did, I probably wouldn't have believed anyone that had anything 'negative' (truthful) to say about the ntcc. For me, I was better off taking the bad route. It gave me enough freedom in my mind and control over my life that it cleared my mind enough so that when the truth was finally presented to me, I was able to see the difference between good and ugly religion. In the process I also learned that nobody is perfect. As much as you strive to be like Jesus, you will always fall short. That's why Paul always opened his epistles with grace and mercy to all. I hated the darkness that I lived in, but it was actually better than the religious lie I was living in the ntcc. I don't recommend the bad and dark path to anyone, because it is not necessary. There is enough information on the internet to show you what kind of a religious cult the ntcc really is. Their true colors have been exposed and when you see that for yourself you can make good choices. Before the ntcc, I thought there were only two choices, good and bad. Right or wrong. Everything was black or white. Beware of false prophets and beware of hypocrites. Follow only Christ and if you are fortunate enough to be around other believers who are not extorting the people of God for money and sex, don't forsake them. You don't have to be around them 24/7, you have a life to live and so do they. There is freedom in Christianity. Don't let the religious twist the scriptures just to keep you in financial and spiritual bondage to them.
27 comments:
If you are staying in an abuse church for your friends, then they probably aren't your real friends in the 1st place.
When did church become about being in a building?
anonx said...
If you are staying in an abuse church for your friends, then they probably aren't your real friends in the 1st place.
DNA said:
There are quite a few that allow themselves to be abused in the ntcc, for the sake of friends or loved ones. There are also people that have left the ntcc that don't want to speak about their experiences in the ntcc because they claim it will hurt their relationship with their loved ones. We know folks that have concealed abuse because they fear rejection from the ones they love that are still in the organization.
It's hard to imagine carrying such a burden for so many years. The ntcc is always cracking the whip on their members and if your mom, dad, sister, brother, son or daughter happen to be X-members of the ntcc, they also are considered unsaved and a danger to the ntcc. When they have knowledge of abuse that they have not shared publicly, they will use the x-member's loved ones who are still in the ntcc as leverage to keep them quiet. I'm not just making this up and there are others who know what we are talking about.
We have a friend who runs a different blog about a different cult. He has children that are in that cult that will not talk to him. He has blogged consistently for years and finally charges have been filed and the cult is getting public attention. Hopefully his efforts will expose this cult on a national level so that even the members who are trapped inside will have to acknowledge what they are going through. If someone were to bring the ntcc into the national spotlight, it would hurt their numbers really bad and people would be forced to open their eyes. Fraud can only be concealed for so long.
It's hard to understand this but if you truly love someone in the ntcc, and you know about the abuse, concealing it is not doing your loved ones any favors. The more that people come forward, the more the word gets out. The best thing that can happen to those you love is for the ntcc to be exposed. Your loved ones have a better chance of reestablishing a relationship with you if the ntcc is no longer between you.
Anonymous said...
When did church become about being in a building?
DNA said:
In many of the religious organizations throughout the world it's about a building. In the ntcc, a building is placed as a higher priority than the people who have to pay for it. It's more important that you make payments on a building that is already paid off, than it is for you to buy a mattress to sleep on. So many in the ntcc ministry do without so they can have a building. That building is not going to save people any more than the mountainside that Jesus preached on saved the people under the sound of His voice.
Jesus never emphasized having a building to preach in so why will the ntcc place so great a burden on the church members to do so? The ntcc big wigs are living high on the hog off of your tithe, while you are struggling to make ends meet and sinking your time and labor into a building that is only going to make them richer.
Speaking on the topic of buildings. I remember being 9 years old living in Louisiana. We had a very nice building that was fully paid for had electricity, heat, cool air, and hot water. We still had a monthly payment that we had to pay the organization's big pockets. We lived in a shack that had no heat, no fans for the warm weather, no hot water, electricity was only in part of the house. I remember having my long thick hair washed in cold water, the poor excuse for a bed, having no food at times, government cheese, powdered milk, one dress to wear by day and a nightgown by night. Oh but praise the Lord we had a nice building, nice songbooks, cushioned pews, nice organ, nice piano, and deluxe pulpit. Our living conditions were so bad that Davis wouldn't come near it. He would stay over by the church for it was a very nice area and the church was on a beautiful property. In fact Mom and Pop were the only leaders ever well living there willing to step foot in this shack we lived in.
Now this went on many years of living like poor beggars while paying on a church that was fully paid of in some cases repeatedly. The last church Ralph St. Clair pastored before he died was Tillicum which as many know that property has been around since the early 70s. Ralph was still taking in money to make payments to Graham for the building.
As it has been said a building as truly become more important than the people that use it. All church members have become to greed people is a way to get money using the excuse we need to pay the rent, the payments, or mortgage. How is a church building helping people? It isn't helping. I find quite strange that large churches will stress the need for the buildings yet some will admit that you can get lost in the shuffle so it isn't benefiting. Whereas if that same church broke off into small groups each group meeting in each others home there would be no need for the high expenses of a building.
DNA said.......
"The ntcc is always cracking the whip on their members and if your mom, dad, sister, brother, son or daughter happen to be X-members of the ntcc, they also are considered unsaved and a danger to the ntcc. When they have knowledge of abuse that they have not shared publicly, they will use the x-member's loved ones who are still in the ntcc as leverage to keep them quiet. I'm not just making this up and there are others who know what we are talking about."
Julie says.....
Yes this does happen. I personally know of cases myself where people are scared into silence. They say they fear ever doing what I did in speaking out. Some will not even be openly known as my friends for fear what they think will happen to them. I understand that fear yet I will say this fear gives the spiritual abuser power and the reins to be in charge of what happens.
Anonymous said...
"When did church become about being in a building?"
Someone realized the power, the money, and control they could gain by making people believe that being in a building was in obedience to God. Then using guilt to keep them coming more than once a week and without totally saying it leading people to feel going to a building attending all the functions are somehow connected to their salvation or destroy someone else's chance of salvation. For instance you miss Tuesday's bible study, so and so might have come got saved but your disobedience kept them from salvation so if they were to die it would be your fault they did not go to heaven. You may say Julie that is crazy. I have personally seen that play out like that and also similar situations. Now people don't dare challenge their pastors and say that have shared salvation with these people but they are not willing to except.
Julie said:
"Our living conditions were so bad that Davis wouldn't come near it."
DNA said:
It is sad that Davis created a lot of the living conditions that people in the ntcc had to endure. He was always willing to allow people to live in slums while he thumbed his nose at them for not being able to put things together.
He used to have me drive him around because he didn't want to squeeze into Steave Dorsie's car. It was too economical and small. I was the idiot who drove a 13,000.00 GMC Safari gass guzzling Van around to pick up people for church, which we very seldom had new visitors in those days. Davis liked being hauled around in my van so he could sink his butt into a luxurious captains chair. The Dorsies had a new house that was spotless and Davis chose to stay in a motel, (on our dime), rather than to stay in Dorsie's guest room. Of course Davis did not have his wife with him on this trip, I shudder to think of what took place in that motel room that we paid for.
Davis showing up without his wife presented a double standard. If anyone else travelled around without their wives and rented motel rooms when they could have stayed in a minister's house, they would have been accused of the same thing. Ntcc'rs will say, "Touch not mine anointed"! I say hold everyone to the same standards and stop making excuses for religious hypocrites.
Davis was always allergic to the poor. I doubt if he would give a suffering homeless man a quarter. He doesn't care how his own ministers live, he surely don't care about anyone else.
Julie said:
"Someone realized the power, the money, and control they could gain by making people believe that being in a building was in obedience to God."
DNA said:
As Julie pointed out, buildings are huge money makers in the ntcc. They are nothing more than an investment for the ntcc, while they are a money trap for the ministers and their congregations. Davis taught that the first thing you should do is get a building. This put a lot of pressure on new ministers trying to pioneer a work for God. The emphasis was on the building more than the people. The priorities were backwards. Get people first and since the ntcc is not going to help you financially, take your time and look for a good deal and when your congregation is big enough to afford a building without bankrupting them, then you can get a building.
A building gives the ntcc an excuse to collect money and it is an investment for them, not you. If it belonged to the people that paid for it, that would be one thing. But the ntcc uses that building as a stream of income. They not only require you to pay for the building, but they also require you to have an escrow and to sink your own money, (or your congregation's money), into repairing that building, buying songbooks, pews, altars, pulpits and so-on. There is nothing in an ntcc ministry that soaks up more of your congregations money than a church building. It gives the ntcc an excuse to take up five offerings a week. It never ends. People will be sinking their hard earned dollars into that money trap until the ntcc sells it for a huge profit.
RW was such a hypocrite...he taught us that a minister should never go anywhere alone, to "protect his testimony." I think he just wanted to make sure that someone was always there to spy on us. No telling what he was up to on his solo journeys.
His teaching about buildings were ambivalent. When I was in BS (and this probably changed, because he was anything but consistent), he told us it was foolish to get a building until we had people. He told us the first thing we should do is find a place to live and get a job. Then we should get ourselves (get ready for this...) A RADIO SHOW! Yup, we were to get on the radio and stick to the simple gospel message and nothing else. He said people would write us, and after awhile, we could share on the air how that God sent us to that city to start a church, and that we were looking for a location. Some sucker might come along and furnish a venue for free, or at least help us find a suitable place for the right price. He also told us to hold bible studies in other peoples' homes, never our own. I think he didn't want preachers going out and getting buildings they couldn't afford, because that would directly impact the amount of cash he could extract from them himself (of course he had no problem sticking them with a building payment they couldn't afford when the money was going to NTCC's coffers). I tried to buy a building in Philadelphia (even on my own dime!) and got shot down because I didn't have people.
He was always changing the formula. One conference he told us that preachers were stupid for hauling books around the country because "you can't get it from a book." The next conference, it was "some of you preachers are stupid--why don't you go out and buy some books." One time, he told us we were wasting our time knocking on doors; then it was "it works for the JWs, and they don't even have the gospel. You need to quit being lazy and knock on some doors." I bet he was laughing the whole time he made us jump through arbitrary hoops like circus animals. I will refrain from using the kind of language that really expresses my opinion of the "apostle," but please feel free to use your imaginations :-) .
RWD did change his mind a lot. That post I did recently on the Proverbs of R-dub, in the notes I took during a conference, RWD was teaching that group of preachers that one of the first things they needed to do was to get a building. Church is a business and you can't have a business without a good location and a building for people to meet in.
I guess when you have Olson the hype man saying that, "If Davis says the sky is green, then the sky is green", it put is all in the state of mind that Davis was always right regardless of how many times he vacillated on things.
One night while visiting the home in Ft. Bragg, R-dub sent me after some Contac cold medicine. He wanted the extra strength but he didn't seem to have any apparent cold or flu symtoms. I went to three different stores and could not find it anywhere. It had been taken off the shelves because of a recall. I had to find a payphone to call Davis and he said to find something else that had the primary ingredient called
Pseudoephedrine. I had to look up the primary ingredient for Contac cold medicine because it's been a long time and I didn't remember the medicinal name for the primary ingredient.
The Drug is a stimulant for shrinking swollen nasal mucous membranes and has side effects which include Central Nervous system stimulation, insomnia, nervousness, excitability, dizziness and anxiety.
The only other uses for the drug are considered off label uses and they include:
1. first-line prophylactic for recurrent priapism. (Erections lasting longer than four hours)
2. Treatment for urinary incontinence.
Not sure exactly why he wanted it so bad, but I certainly jumped through a lot of hoops to get it for him. It might of just been the high he got from it. Others have reported that he had a problem with Nyquil. I know a lot of cold medicines can make you feel pretty loopy. I often thought that a MOG, (Man of Gawd), of his stature could surely be healed of the sniffles, or a little decongestion, but looking back he never had the symtoms. Go figure.
Pseudoephedrine was the active ingredient in Vick's inalers. When I was in Basic Training, another trainee told me that if you broke one open and ate the little absorbent things inside, it was like taking speed. I tried it, and sure enough, I was tweaking.
One guy who worked in the office told me that when he cleaned RW's house, he'd find lots of empty Nyquil bottles and non-alcoholic beer cans in the trash. I guess the Nyquil was for the buzz and the beer for the taste. He also told me that he cleaned up after the board meetings, and could read what people had written on the notepads they used because there was an impression left on the next page. From what he could decipher, the board members each were assigned shares in the org that brought them income. They had some little OPM cash cow club going, apparently, while the rest of us were making bricks for them without straw. They're users.
Vic said:
"He also told me that he cleaned up after the board meetings, and could read what people had written on the notepads they used because there was an impression left on the next page. From what he could decipher, the board members each were assigned shares in the org that brought them income."
Interesting. When you look at the income that is reported to the State of Missouri for Board members, it's almost laughable. Some of the public information that we have seen would lead you to believe that people like Olson, Ashmore and Jones made less than minimum wage.
A scam like the one you mentioned would make a lot of sense because the board members were for the most part fairly well taken care of. I know they had to make more than what was reported publicly to the State of Missouri.
Does a church not have to report what official board members make? I know Kekel has said no one on the board makes such and such amount (I think over 150K). It would seem like there should be a record of income for tax purposes.
All the public references I've seen on how much board members make for a living are all fabricated lies that the ntcc spins so that they can maintain their tax exempt status. There is no way that you can convince me that any of the board members make less than $50,000 per year and that doesn't include their benefits. What benefits? Do you think that all the offerings they take up when they drive around the country in their recreational vehicles are reported? Everything is done in cash, and very little of the money goes where it's supposed to.
How do you think these guys get rich? How can they afford nice cars? How can they afford mansions and Recreational Vehicles? They are hucksters and they are con artists. They don't live off of less than $20,000.00 per year like they report. They have nice clothes, nice houses, nice cars and more. How do you think that Kekel got to be a multimillionaire? Do you think he reports his millions to the IRS? It's almost laughable when you think about it. Kekel has taken you all for fools, and you have fallen for his gag. You have been conned out of your money by a common thug. If it were a ponzi scheme you could charge Kekel with crimes that would put him away for life, but you gave your thousands to him willingly. He got rich off of your gifts and tithe payments.
What DnA said is true. Don't be foolish enough to let Kekel convince you that he simply made good investments. Sure he made good investments and so could I with millions from the church. That dude was broke like the rest of us in the military coming to the NTCC. He didn't become a millionaire investing a measly 1000 dollars that he made as a private way back in the day or a seaman or whatever he was.
Kekel got rich off your tithes and offerings and it's just that simple and whoever thinks otherwise is a blind idiot. So he invested it. It wasn't like it was just going to sit under his bed, (which quite a bit probably has at times).
Anyway. Just keep giving him your tithes and offerings and you'll be sure to buy your way to heaven.
Chief
Chief said...
Anonymous said...
It would seem like there should be a record of income for tax purposes.
Chief said...
A record is only a record if there is a record. The NTCC leadership required that CASH be paid, (specifically in Graham) for rent, tithe, etc. There is only one logical reason that they'd require CASH and CASH only. Because there is no record of cash. It's not like a check that clears through the bank and there is a record of it. You can hide cash and therefor get away with not reporting income or profit.
The NTCC specializes in hiding income from various sources and skimming income from various sources. Zero'd escrow accounts, never letting pastors know how much is in escrow, not letting pastors have any control of their escrow accounts. Bringing in tons of money for world missions that never gets spent on world missions. Taking up large special offerings for a parking lot that never gets paved, (true story that was reported by a credible witness on my blog years ago). The list goes on and on. The NTCC leadership specializes in using church money for everything and anything they please with absolutely ZERO accountability to anyone. They've been getting away with it for decades.
Chief
Chief said:
"A record is only a record if there is a record."
DNA said:
That's the truth, Chief. It doesn't matter in the least bit what the ntcc reports on their ledgers. If there is no record of giving, there is no way to hold them accountable. It doesn't matter if the ntcc leaders amass a huge fortune and live in luxury right under your noses, if there is no record, they can't be held accountable. The Jehovah's Witnesses report, much of their internal church member labor is considered a "Labor of Love" and they don't get paid for it. When Davis paid the building crew in cash after subtracting their tithe, that money was his to do whatever he wanted with.
It doesn't matter if people accuse the ntcc of misappropriation of funds or embezzling or whatever, if there is no record there is no prosecution. Now if a bunch of former ntcc'rs were to get together and testify before a Grand Jury, maybe some indictments would be handed down, but the problem is that everyone is too scared of the ntcc and to afraid to stand against them. After all these years people still believe that they will be judged for anything they say against these hucksters and con artists. There are a lot of people out there with knowledge that wont talk, because of fear. The ntcc did a good job brainwashing them and filling them with fear.
If everyone were to flood the office of the DA in Pierce County with a concerted effort to expose everything they've done over the years, maybe it would be effective, but most people don't even want to blog or sign their name to their comments on the blog. Therefore it will never happen. All the ntcc has to do is cross their fingers and hope that the wrong person doesn't talk.
So who is the wrong person that would talk?
Couldn't pastors, who took up hundreds in offerings, request where the money went?
Di Francesco is a name I often here but does he even know?
This may be a case where following the money proves fruitless. Maybe following the assets would prove easier. Then again if the church claims ownership of the property they could squirm out of that as well.
Learning of the real estate empire caught my attention from the beginning. I could have never imagined that after being out for over a decade, this is what I'd learn this org was all about from the get go. I can move on to some degree but am now angry I've paid for the crap in Mike's house.
Kekel, you're going to burn in hell!
They can obliterate all the paper trails they want, but a competent forensic accountant would have no trouble bringing their deeds to light. All the assets they have came from somewhere. If they're claiming it was "investments," then they'll have to show just what investments proved so lucrative. They won't be able to, because most of their ill-gotten loot came directly from OPM. But it's proven to be impossible to get the IRS to take any interest so far. Churches have all kinds of leeway, which is why it's so easy for shysters like RW to rip so many people off for so long with impunity.
But he didn't take any with him.
Why did the ntcc never have official membership like most churches? Is this a way to evade taxes?
Anonymous said...
Why did the ntcc never have official membership like most churches? Is this a way to evade taxes?
DNA said:
Churches with memberships empower the members of the congregation to have voting powers and if the leadership of that church becomes corrupt they can get rid of the thugs by voting them out. It can be a two edged sword however because some church memberships require works, like paying tithes to become a member with voting powers.
If used as a safety measure to keep church leaders honest, it can be a very good vehicle to bring about transparency and accountability among church leaders.
The ntcc actually had a vote but it was pitched as a formality by Davis and the process was mocked as an unnecessary event to fulfill a requirement by the state of Missouri. Davis often mocked people by saying, "I wasn't voted in and nobody is voting me out".
In all actuality, Ntcc members do have the power to remove the ntcc leadership according to the state laws of Missouri. A majority of the members has to vote to have the current leaders removed and replaced.
The problem is that ntcc members are petrified because they are being manipulated and controlled by some master brain washing cult leaders and they are scared and fearful to try to change anything from within. It would take someone like Martin Luther on the inside of the ntcc to crusade for change and garner support. I doubt if there is anyone inside the ntcc that has the backbone to fight in this manner, and before Kekel or Olson allowed that person enough traction to influence others they would probably have their reputation smeared and irreparably damaged before all the ones that could effect change.
L Ron Hubbard of Scientology said that only people who run a religion have any real money. Looks like Davis got on that train and rode it all the way to hell. Kekel, you're on your way to meet your father in law you #%$#!
Well, RW is a liar--we did vote him in, and I was there. It was during a conference, and it was a voice vote. Even though the result was assured, it seemed like it was a tense moment for him. But we went along just like the brainwashed cattle we were.
Anonymous said...
L Ron Hubbard of Scientology said that only people who run a religion have any real money. Looks like Davis got on that train and rode it all the way to hell. Kekel, you're on your way to meet your father in law you #%$#!
DNA said:
I understand your strong feelings on this issue. You could very well be correct. L Ron Hubbard and Davis were birds of a feather. They both were big time cult leaders, manipulators and brain wash specialists. They believed that it was necessary for them to start an organization of their own to make "real" money. Following someone else is not where the real money is at. Kekel inherited a fully operational cult that was bringing in lot's of cash. Tanya was Kekel's gravy train and now he is the biggest profiteer in ntcc history. Anyone else in the ntcc is just following and they will only get a cut as Kekel allows.
Hubbard, Davis and Kekel have done a horrible thing. They have used the gospel to become rich, but in the process have hurt too many souls to count. They have committed spiritual genocide many times over and God being a just God will sort it all out.
I personally find no joy or satisfaction in this process but I have to agree with you in principle. I don't know how God can ignore all the people that have been destroy to make a few cult leaders rich.
P.S. I replaced your colorful metaphor with some symbols that are representative of what you shared. We try to keep profanity off the blog mainly because we don't want to run off ntcc'rs before they have a chance to read the content. No judgement on my part toward you in any way.
Saw that Lecrae song. It made me cry!
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