Seeking Their Own Wealth - One Lie at a Time

Scripture of the day:

1 Cor 10:24

"Let no man seek his own, but every man another's [wealth]."

Boy, Davis and Kekel really took that one to the bank, didn't they?  Not that they care for your welfare, but are seeking to take your wealth from you and put it into their bank accounts.  As they like to quote, "A fool and his money are soon parted."  Then they laugh at your poverty, calling you "Strong backs with weak minds."  You do their work for them, and pay them to get treated like a chump or a lump of something from the poo pond!

Davis once wrote in the Trumpet Vol. 1 - Sept. 95:

Seldom do I ever use the expression "I can't." You may hear me use it when people are trying to get money out of me. Generally, when I do say the phrase "I can't," I immediately amend it to "I won't."

And seriously, who has ever been so foolish as to try and "get money out of" davis?  You'd have better luck trying to pry a dusty mite out of Ebenezer Scrooge's wallet!

But getting back to davis' statement "I can't" [give you money]....  How many of our readers think that it's okay to be a liar?  Do you think that when Davis says that he can't give money to a person that he is telling the truth? Generally, he has to amend his statement to "I won't".  For a man that claims he can't remember the last time he sinned, this sure does seem like a confession!  He has to change his words and amend them because he lies!

What if davis' nose grew with
every lie he told?  It'd be longer
than a telephone pole or wire!

The ntcc used to preach against telling 'little white lies'; but for Davis to say that he can't give someone money is a big wolf cookie of a lie.  Of course, he would probably say it's true; because Gawd wouldn't let him give money to a brother. That's an even bigger lie!  Because the scripture also talks about seeing your brother in need and shutting up your bowels of compassion. [1 John 3:17]  How many times have preachers had needs and Davis has told them to "take up an offering"?  How many times have those in the ministry lived in squalor, way below the poverty level, while Davis and Kekel are engorging themselves on wealth and power, while ignoring their brethren's needs?

Davis has already made up his mind on this issue.  He says "I can't" when people "try to get money out of" him.  What about when people try to get compassion out of him?  What about when people need spiritual help and they are sent away empty handed.  Davis doesn't want to be bothered.  He has his piece of the pie [that you bought for him]; and he wants to enjoy his riches; so don't bother him with your petty problems. Go see Olson or Johnson or Ashmore, but don't expect Davis to do anything meaningful.  And expect Olson and Johnson and Ashmore to treat you the same way Davis did!

"A Lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on it's shoes." -- Charles Spurgeon

"By mixing a little truth with it, they made their lie far stronger." --  C.S. Lewis

This is going to be straight and to the point and we are not going to draw this out. Davis is a liar.  Kekel is a liar.  They are not bible-believing church leaders. They are con-artists; and they are diabolical experts at using the bible to condemn others; while they feel absolutely no need to justify their own selfish actions.  They live contrary to their own teaching, while expecting others to follow the letter of the law.  Davis has very little compassion and does very little for anyone unless they are in his own family.  We truly believes he only does for them because they are a reflection of him or extension of himself.  Otherwise they too would be out in the cold.  Kekel and Davis both have gates to keep people off of their property and away from their castles!  They also have intercom systems to screen unwanted visitors.  They are Cult leaders that live on a Cult compound; and they are habitual liars.  They lie to obtain wealth.  Davis and Kekel keep people walking on eggshells and so worried about their own imagined sins that they don't bother to take an honest look at the these religious hucksters whom they emulate [admire / respect] and serve.

These things have been shared over and over; but it seems like people will never learn.  Whom do you love more, Davis or God?  Is Davis your god?  Is Kekel your god?  Why would you continue to give your money to these cult leaders when they are living contrary to God?  Where in the bible, (specifically in the New Testament) do you see anyone getting rich off of the gospel? NOWHERE!    Where does God say to seek your own wealth and not that of another?  NOWHERE!  Davis and Kekel are seeking their own wealth. They are not in it for anyone but themselves.  If you don't believe me, ask them for some money.  Ask them how much money they have.  Ask them where did it all come from. They will ruthlessly blast you.  They will get furious.  And their anger will be known to everyone.  Is that the type of person you want to trust with your soul?  Is that whom you want to follow to heaven?  If you continue to follow them you will surely fall into many foolish and hurtful lusts; as it is written:

1Tim 6:9  But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and [into] many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.

Are you a man of God?  Listen to the commandment:

1Tim 6:11  But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness.

Click those verses and read it for yourself.  Don't be like double-tongued Davis:

Liar, Liar by The Castaways Lyrics Video OnYouTube or Below:

Liar, Liar by The Castaways Music Video On YouTube or Below:

Related Post:  Rodger Wilson Davis The Adulterer

Rodger Wilson Davis: The Adulterer

 Rodger Wilson Davis: The
Adulterer

We spoke with a man, who years ago attended the  ntcc seminary; which, at that time, was called the New Testament Christian College, in St. Louis, Missouri.  He said not long after he and his wife arrived in St. Louis, (less than a week after), they  and the couple they were staying with drove up to the church and saw a man holding a rifle on R. W. Davis.  There were loud words exchanged, and the man with the rifle and R. W. Davis left in one car, with rw driving and the other man in the back seat still holding the gun on rw.  The new bible school student, the man with whom I spoke, and the other brother he came to church with, got in their car and caught up with them; at which time rw motioned with his hand to go ahead, to move on; which they did.  Upon returning to their house, the other brother retrieved his gun and left again to find rw.

The man,  who was present and witnessed these things first hand told them to me in a phone conversation.  He told me the name of the man who held the gun on r.w. davis, and that confirmed the name I had already been told; others knew that davis had committed adultery with that man's wife (and then some).  This is the same event that I have previously discussed on The Dispatch, according to what was reported to me.  The two stories have one variation.  In The Dispatch article, those reporting the matter said that the betrayed man with the gun forced davis to kneel  and told him "You better pray."  The man on the phone did not see that.  His story, I believe, happened after davis and the betrayed man exited the church.  As the witness said, he, the other brother, and their wives had just driven up to the church (on Forest Ave.) and saw what is shared above.  In my mind, these stories are congruent and accurate, with only a slight variation in the time at which the witnesses saw their part of the event.

This true true story describes the fallout caused by the adultery that davis committed against only one family.  But there are other instances of davis slinking around doors of other mens' wives, all while these husbands were at work.  Other women have shared how they saw davis knocking on doors of young (still not legal adults) married girls who attended the bible school.  One of those young girls said davis committed illicit sexual acts with her, taking advantage of his position of trust and her naivety.  These other women present during that time witnessed davis entering this girl's home.  And, they said, davis also tried to get them to open their doors for him while their husbands were at work; but they did not do so.

Also, on a different blog, a former ntcc Bible School instructor and minister, Vic Johanson shared this testimony:

Vic Johanson said...
Speaking of RW's ways, I was talking to an NTCC escapee the other day, and he said that he was talking to a minister in his town, whose father was from St. Louis. He related that his father had donated his book collection to a startup bible college there, whose founder was implicated in some adulterous affairs shortly thereafter. He couldn't remember the name, so my friend said "might it have been Davis?" and the guy immediately replied "RW Davis."

We were just the last to find out; that information was hidden from us. All we heard was how the Carondelet church "didn't want holiness." The truth appears that they didn't want a philandering "pastor."

APRIL 05, 2012 5:05 PM

From original post at New Testament Christian Churches, The Real Story:
http://www.truestoriesoflifeinthentcc.blogspot.com/2012/03/keep-it-in-your-church-rwd-would-in.html

These multiple witnesses verify the adulterous nature of davis. He is an impenitent adulterer.  And what's worse is he condemns some men for lesser sins, while excusing others like phil kinson who have shown no indication of repentance.  God is not a respecter of persons:

Act 10:34  Then Peter opened [his] mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:

He can forgive all who are willing to confess their sin; as it is written:

1Jo 1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

The problem with hypocrites like davis is that they feel they have no need of a physician.  They think they are better than "sinners".  They are afraid to be around them, afraid their self-righteous reputations might take a hit.  But Jesus ate with the sinners:

Mar 2:16  And when the scribes and Pharisees saw him eat with publicans and sinners, they said unto his disciples, How is it that he eateth and drinketh with publicans and sinners?

Mar 2:17 When Jesus heard [it], he saith unto them, They that are whole have no need of the physician, but they that are sick: I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

But davis is full of self-righteousness and pride,  boasting:

"I can't remember the last time I sinned."--r w davis brags.  But the bible says:

1John 1:8  If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

1John 1:10  If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

davis' boasting is outlandish (at best) or devilish deceit (at worst), and such boasting calls God a liar.  But the bible says God cannot lie:

Titus 1:2  In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

 It is impossible for God, The Truth, to lie:

Hebrews 6:18  That by two immutable things, in which [it was] impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

John 14:6  Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Stilll, some men insist on living in deceitful denial of their sin.  I, just like Alan Parsons, wouldn't want to be like them either:

I Wouldn't Want To Be Like You by The Alan Parsons Project On YouTube

Instead, we cry out:

"Sir, we would see Jesus!" - John 12:21 (partial) (here)

One day each of us will die. Will you really hear "Well done, good and faithful servant...."? Or will it be "Bind him hand and foot, ... and cast him into outer darkness...."? (Matthew 22:13)  The saddest death of all was that of Israel's first King, Saul. For he was rejected by God. (1 Sam 16:1)  Yes, King Saul had been anointed. But he refused to obey. He couldn't see who truly loved him. As a result he hunted like a dog, the man, David, who fought for God, for Israel, and for love of the very man who was trying to kill him, Saul. David would succeed Saul as King of Israel, not due to any treachery of David's; but simply because God had so ordained it. When Saul was dead, David wept and lamented the loss of Saul and Jonathan [2 Sam 1:17-27].

I've lost respect for davis and his closest followers and supporters.  But like David, I will mourn their deaths and remember what could have been or should have been.  It's not that these men were not anointed; I believe they were.  But I believe they forsook that anointing and the God Who bought them with His blood.  They wanted the world.  And just as the audio version of The Pilgrim's Progress stated:  "Those who take up Christ to gain the world, will lose Christ to keep the world."  That's how I see these men who run the business, the organization called New Testament Christian Churches of America, Inc.  They would rather keep their money, than allow God to keep them.

Holding Onto God or To Your Confessions? on YouTube:

Want more Alan Parsons Project?  Try this embedded playlist:

More Alan Parsons Project Playlist on YouTube

The first video, a mash-up of Alan Parsons' "I Robot" and "I Wouldn't Want to be Like You" contains a screen shot (~5:57-6:00~) of the movie, "I, Robot" starring Will Smith.  The subtitle reads "One man saw it coming."  How fitting.  One man saw it coming, and didn't want to be like you, r.w.!

In Case You Were Wondering:
If so many people know about these acts of adultery, why haven't they come forward?  It seems that for some reason folks have largely remained silent about this.  Perhaps they discussed it more in different forums.  Perhaps they are trying to protect the victims.  Yet God had His servants record in the bible both  the names of  Bathseba and David when they committed adultery. Perhaps people  are afraid of the false ntcc doctrine that "touch not mine anointed" means one can't speak about an anointed one's sin?  The bible clearly shows "anointed" ones being rebuked for their sins.  Nathan rebuked David for his sin of adultery.  And David challenged Saul for hunting him for no reason.  But David would not let his men physically harm Saul.  That is the difference.  We know David obtained mercy despite committing adultery and murder by proxy.    David repented.  He did not continue in sin.  He obtained mercy and truly turned from his sin.

What will you do, rw?  Will you continue to play the "Games People Play?  Will you continue to spout off that you are the "Eye in the Sky" when that title belongs to Another? Will you seize this opportunity to repent?  Or will the "Time" come when we mourn you, "Goodbye, My Friend" like it says in the song or as Christ called Judas Iscariot "Friend"?

Mat 26:48  Now he that betrayed him gave them a sign, saying, Whomsoever I shall kiss, that same is he: hold him fast.

Mat 26:49  And forthwith he came to Jesus, and said, Hail, master; and kissed him.

Mat 26:50  And Jesus said unto him, Friend, wherefore art thou come? Then came they, and laid hands on Jesus, and took him.

Luk 22:48  But Jesus said unto him, Judas, betrayest thou the Son of man with a kiss?

I've come to wonder over the years why that man, Alan Parsons, didn't pull the trigger on old r.w.  I suppose 'twas mercy stayed his hand.  Yet 44+ years later, viewing, from hindsight, the aftermath of destruction wrought upon the untold unsuspecting souls by davis and his disciples, I again have to wonder; Would it have been more merciful to pull the trigger?  One down, thousands spared years of grief and destruction, of sexual immorality and perversion, of child and wife abuse, of fractured faith and frustrated futures.  Well, only God knows.  He is the True Eye In The Sky.  He is longsuffering, not willing that any should perish:

2Pe 3:9  The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

So how 'bout it, rahj?  Will you for once in your life repent?  There's still hope, as long as you're still breathing.  Right?  Isn't that what you or olson taught?  There's hope as long as still breathing.  Unless those breaths are taken from a person's death-bed or by the thief on the cross; right?  That is also what you taught.  Well, rahj, which way would you want it for you on your deathbed?  Why teach two things that contradict each other and try to claim, as r w davis so often has:

"I've never missed God."--by which Rodger Wilson Davis claimed to mean that he was infallible, never missing the will of God; but now I wonder if it really means he is no longer troubled by the absence of God from his life; rodger never missed God.

"All I do is by the Holy Ghost."--Rodger Wilson Davis' claim to infamy.  Puh-leez don't blaspheme the Sweet Holy Spirit, rodger, by blaming the Holy Ghost for all the wicked stuff you've done.  The Holy Ghost never told you to commit adultery!

And how about it, readers?  Did you, as I once did, hold these men in high esteem?  Were you, as was I, duped?  Don't despair.  The bible said every man a liar:

Rom 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

Are you broken by the borg?  Trust Jesus.  God is able to keep that which is committed unto Him:

2Ti 1:12  For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed: for I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

I don't hold much hope for davis and his impenitent ilk to repent.  But, beloved, for those who have been broken by the borg-scoundrels, I believe better things for you:

1 Tim 6:11-14
1 Tim 6:6-10

Phil Kinson's Adultery Impacts Moreno Murders: Roland Moreno Tragedy Begins to Unfold 8 Years After The Former New Testament Christian Church Member Allegedly Murders His Pregnant Wife, Young Child, Confesses to NTCC Pastor Jake Espinoza and Then Takes His Own Life.

This is a very tragic story and we take no pleasure in stories like this.  It's very sad that this tragedy ever happened and there are no words to describe how something this horrible could have happened as the result of a person being involved with what many consider to be a Christian Church.  The New Testament Christian Churches of America, Inc. masquerades  as a "non-profit" Christian church but they are a very deceptive cult that has a long history of behavior and actions that are not Christ-like.

We have been following some comments on Chief's Blog by an anonymous commentator that states that Roland Moreno was a member of the New Testament Christian Church in Okinawa, Japan.  The details shared anonymously by this person were that Roland was asked by his ntcc 'pastor', Phil Kinson, to give him a ride to "retrieve his wallet" and the place where Roland drove Phil Kinson to retrieve his wallet was a whore house.  It was shared that after Roland reported Phil Kinson for being at a whore house, it was "the beginning of the end" for the Moreno family but not for the Adulterer [Phil Kinson].  While Phil Kinson was moved from Okinawa, Japan, he was quickly promoted to overseer status.

Moreno was ostracized, black-listed and the whole mess was brushed under the carpet.  After carrying this burden around and being treated worse than the perpetrator of the adultery and sharing details of this with others, Roland Moreno reportedly shot and killed his pregnant wife and young child.  He then called his ntcc pastor, Jake Espinoza, and confessed to killing his family.  While it has been reported that Roland was seeking forgiveness, we don't know all the details of this phone conversation.  Roland Moreno reportedly then turned the gun on himself and pulled the trigger, allegedly ending his own life.

Also on Chief's Blog, Rev. Mathew Reed, who was also a former ntcc pastor of Roland Moreno, verified that most of the same details given by the anonymous person on Chief's Blog were also shared by Moreno with him.  Pastor Reed added that Moreno told him the details of Phil Kinson's adultery and the aftermath that took place in his own life.

 Phil Kinson said about
 his sex with a whore:
"It isn't adultery
 if you wear a condom!"
 So rest easy, Debbie Johnson,
 Feel-Good-Phil wasn't really
 cheating on you; just ask him;
 and he will tell you! *wink* NOT!  

Roland Moreno told Rev. Matt Reed that
Phil Kinson said: 


"It's not adultery if you use a condom!"  -- Phil Kinson  

Phil Kinson went on to bigger and better things in ntcc, pastoring their seminary's mega-chapel in Graham, Wa. while J.R. Ashmore took over the church in Okinawa.  Moreno's life was made miserable by Ashmore; who treated Moreno worse than Kinson; who was promoted.  Later, Former ntcc Pastor Mathew Reed confronted R.W. Davis the founder of New Testament Christian Churches of America, Inc. about Phil Kinson's admitted adultery.

Here is a comment that Pastor Reed left on Chief's blog:

MDR here. After reading the latest posts, I decided it was time to chime in. First let me say that I never wanted to go public with this, but evidently it's already out there and I didn't realize how many others know about it too.


After I became Roland's pastor, he told me he needed to talk to me because something was heavy on his heart. Let me just say that what you've read here is almost exactly what he shared with me.


I carried this for years and finally took it to RWD [R. W. Davis] in 2005, and told him I had a problem with his leadership. I pointed to the adulterer [Philip Arthur Kinson] and told RWD I couldn't understand how that he exalted that man to an overseer position.


[Rodger Wilson Davis] RWD had previously gotten up in conferences and made it abundantly clear if you committed adultery as a minister in his organization, that you would have your license taken from you, he would expose your sin to your wife, and you would never be a leader in his organization.

It bothered me because it was clear to me at that point that RWD would change the rules to fit his own agenda. After I approached RWD about this, his treatment toward me definitely changed.


NTCC resembles the church of Laodicea in every respect. It is filled with adulterers, adulteresses, and money-hungry thieves.

I can say this one thing: Thank God we are free and we rejoice in this fact every day, that we can serve God under His wonderful grace and not under the bondage of their manmade laws.
mdr

After speaking with Pastor Reed on the phone, Chief posted his thread entitled:  "Oh the Hypocrisy that Drove a Man to Murder and Suicide".  This thread gives an account of details that Pastor Reed shared with Chief via phone conversation and includes a link to a news report of the tragedy.

From Chief's blog [text in brackets added for clarity]:

This is a tough one. Not quite as easy as I [Chief] expected but nevertheless, here we go. There was a man in the NTCC by the name of Roland Moreno. Roland personally observed his NTCC pastor leaving a whore house in Japan. Roland confronted the pastor and a heated confrontation erupted between Roland and his pastor concerning the obvious impropriety and truly unchristian-like conduct committed by the supposed "man of God" [Philip Kinson]. According to the account which I was personally told, the pastor [Phil Kinson] said that his conduct didn't classify as adultery because he wore a condom during his sexual act with the whore. This pastors name was Phil Kinson!

Roland was somehow able to provide notification to the NTCC leadership concerning Kinson's misconduct and Mr. Kinson was later removed from Okinawa Japan and replaced by another minister. This is when Roland's big troubles began. The minister that replaced Mr. Kinson was Mr. [James Ross] Ashmore, and Mr. [James Ross] Ashmore promptly proceeded to blacklist and ostracize Roland Moreno. Never again was Roland Moreno treated justly by the NTCC leadership. The NTCC leadership to include R.W. Davis systematically targeted Roland Moreno and his wife from that point forward. Word to the wise; (At which point in time you elect to challenge the authority, credibility or morality of an NTCC pastor, you better be prepared to promptly leave the New Testament Christian Church for good). You'll never win that battle and Roland had to find that out the hard way.

At a later date, M.D. Reed had the fortitude and courage to confront R.W. Davis directly concerning this scandal. Pastor Reed wanted to know why RWD would promote Mr. [Phil] Kinson (who was known to have committed adultery) to the position of overseer within the New Testament Christian Church. R.W. Davis pointed his finger in Pastor Reed's face and essentially scolded Pastor Reed for involving himself in another man's adulterous affairs. M.D. Reed posted a statement on this blog, where you can read it on the previous thread.

Ultimately Roland Moreno was blacklisted by the NTCC leadership because he uncovered Mr. Kinson's sin. The blacklisting obviously occurred because Kinson is the son-in-law of an NTCC overseer [Jim L. Johnson] and in case you haven't figured it out yet, the NTCC is a family business. This resulted in Roland succumbing to extreme depression which caused him to [allegedly] take the life of himself and his family. Plainly put, "The NTCC leadership drove Moreno mad".

Attached below is a news article which addresses Mr. Moreno's death.

http://www.texnews.com/1998/2003/texas/texas_Police_se925.html

This is a true story which has been verified by the credible and reliable. I was told this first hand and to the best of my knowledge I'm reporting factual information. Make no mistake; double standard hypocrites who preach fire and brimstone will eventually be found out. This is tragic and truly sad for all parties involved. These crooked preachers need to do the honorable thing and leave the pulpit and stop judging everyone but themselves.

I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints (Mr. Moreno's blood and the blood of his family is on the hands of the NTCC leadership)

And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double. How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow. Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.

In a comment left by Pastor Reed on Chief's thread, MDR also answered an anonymous comment that stated:

Anon said "I suggest to you that if Kinson committed this act, its possible that Gods grace just might be sufficient to forgive him of that heinous sin."

MDR said...

Once again, you try to deflect the topic from the real issue. Davis exalted this piece of work to a leadership position after HE SAID that would never happen in HIS organization.

If a man repents, that's between him and God, and I definitely don't have a problem with that. I told Davis that when I came to him about this situation. God's grace IS sufficient.

But I saw how Roland's wife, Maria, was treated in that conference, when Davis got up and unmercifully plowed her in the ground just because she wanted to stop and look at some of God's beautiful creation. He said that she should care for souls as much as she likes those horses. (I wonder if Davis, the Kekels or you ever had those thoughts when you're in the diamond stores or furniture marts. Hmmmm! Hypocrite!) [Yellow highlights added by Don and Ange for emphasis.]
After that service my wife and I were at the Moreno's van consoling Maria, who was crying uncontrollably because of what Davis said to her in that service. She asked me, "Pastor Reed, why did he say that to me? I've done nothing wrong."

And let me just say for the record, both Roland and Maria cared passionately for souls and brought many people to church. I would say they cared about souls far more than any of you hypocrites who deserve to be thrown on a dung hill.

You can try to brand Moreno as a nut, but you're the real nut job, and you're in a basket full of nuts. You'll never convince me that the unfaithful pastor/husband's [Phil Kinson's] actions and the subsequent treatment by other leaders [James Ross Ashmore and Rodger Wilson Davis] in the NTCC didn't have a part in Rolands mental demise.

The Morenos were among the most wonderful people that my wife and I have ever known, and anyone who knew them knows what I'm saying is true.

mdr
Ironically, in yet another tragic story, Pastor Jake Espinoza, who reportedly spake with Moreno on the phone just before he pulled the trigger which ended his own life, had a similar tragedy in his own family according to this unverified story submitted as a comment on Chiefs blog:

I heard the same story from somebody close to the espinosas.
Apparently their younger brother suffered from some type of mental illness and had a shoot out with the washington police.

He tried to kill his girlfriend and baby, but she was able to get away and call the police. I'm not sure if he killed himself or the police killed him.

Maybe you can find more factual info in the archives of the news there in puyallup because I wasn't around when that happened. I think the year was 07 or 08.

We have followed this story and decided to summarize what was shared in this thread so that people that search this story can find public details as reported by those close to this tragedy. We hope that people in the ntcc or those that consider attending the ntcc do a thorough examination into the affairs of the ntcc before deciding to attend.

Related Threads:

1)  Moreno Tragedy:  Click Here

2)  Updated: Kinson, Kinson, You Too Have Sinned: Click Here

3)  Full Series About The Loss of
The Moreno Family Click Here